Forumite Members › General Topics › Politics › UK › Will TIG totally wipe out the Lib's?
- This topic has 52 replies, 10 voices, and was last updated 7 years ago by
The VFM Addict.
-
AuthorPosts
-
February 27, 2019 at 10:54 pm #31188
having been bludgeon by austerity measures. I do wonder if you have seen the effect they have close-up like I have. No correct that. I’m pretty certain you have not or you would surely have cited such in your post.
When have I ever claimed to be “bludgeoned” by austerity? Why do you always have to get personal?
Loss of local amenities like libraries affects everyone, cuts to local transport affects me disproportionately as I have no alternative means of getting about. Until recently we have had no bus service for 8 years, this involved me in a painful 20 minute walk to the nearest service, even worse returning home uphill. They have built a bypass to take motorway traffic straight into Bradley Stoke and that passes where I live. Now they have implemented the Metrobus I do have a service into the centre.
I help a small Youth Housing Charity with their IT. I see exactly what the local government funding cuts have had on the charity and the kids they try to help. They get food from the left overs at the supermarkets, FareShare I think it is. I have just refreshed their PCs for the first time in 6/7 years, it’s been make do and mend but they’ve finally become too unreliable. That’s money that won’t get spent on the kids but it had to be done.
Schools in South Gloucestershire have always been one of the worst funded and will be the lowest in England by 2020.
Lets just say I do have first hand experience of the direct affects of Tory policy in many different ways. But I don’t think that having the temerity to go on a 5 day city break holiday (£35 each way on EasyJet) makes me overly affluent. As part of my redundancy I could take my Post Office pension immediately and this pays the bills. I only earn about £4 to 500 a month from the business. That is where the holidays etc. come from. The combined balances of my bank accounts today have 3 figures not 4 or 5. Not that it is any business of yours, but your ability to put words into others mouths and decide what sort of lives they lead or views they hold is becoming tiresome. Then based on the “facts” that you have made up you get indignant and start attacking.
Enough.
February 28, 2019 at 5:03 am #31190Sorry – obviously I was totally floored by your undirected rhetoric which was apparently addressed to JCD, but you wanted a reply from all. To which I wrongly assumed you would be waiting for JCD’s comments. You then addressed a post to me, and included general rhetoric to which you did not want a reply, but then complained that I had not replied. Confusing — Hell yes, just like some of your Brexit spinning!
Ed, the sequence you state is incorrect but that aside, posts on a thread are not personal messages even if they are responses to other’s posts. They are effectively open letters because this is a forum.
There was no ambiguity in my post albeit in response to JCD that read:
“If there is two things I believe everyone of this thread would agree with. First that Politics in the UK is fatally wounded – and – Second that we desperately need PR if we want compromise and consensual decisions to be reached. Is it – So say all of us, lads? I do hope so.”
JCD is obviously not “everyone”; JCD is obviously not “all of us”; and he is not “lads”. Your first post after I had written that commenced:
“I can accept or agree nothing…….”
In no other post than that the one I quote above had I asked for anyone to ‘agree’ to anything. So quite blooming obviously I thought that you were responding to my question regarding whether we all agree that politics is broken and we need PR. How flipping hell else could your words logically be taken. Do try to keep up, Ed.
_______________________________________________________________________________________
During the Covid-19 Epidemic I will be wearing a mask and goggles while posting so that if I become infected I won't spread it to you.
February 28, 2019 at 7:10 am #31192@VFM the normal convention in a forum is that a comment addressed to @ed1p etc is primarily meant for that person’s response and anything then addressed in the round is mere rhetoric, which may or may not get a comment from someone else.
No need to lose your cool, we all understand that Moggites are under enormous stress trying to rationalise their continual spinning and turning in their efforts to find ways of dealing with uncomfortable facts and realities!
BTW I felt no need to respond on PR as I had previously made my views on our broken democracy perfectly plain to the extent that you actually said that you agreed with that process.
February 28, 2019 at 7:15 am #31194Dave, this thread is of course one of many from both here and the old MM forum that are closely and inseparably Brexit related. None can therefore be viewed in isolation.
I recall at no stage seeing in any of those threads Remainers being directly insulted as “delusional”, “idiots”, “stupid”, “racist”, “extremists”, etc Any intolerance of the alternative view point has always been on the part of Remainers as studies and surveys have found; with Leavers (of which I am blatantly one) being constantly labelled one of the above.
I have been for several decades now left of centre although in my youth I was fully left. An old 8mm reel in the family achieve records me canvassing for Labour. I am no more an idiot, delusional, stupid or a racist than was Tony Benn. I do accept that some may have considered Benn a left extremist. For those who do then perhaps I am also one regarding the EU. My position on it is identical to Benn’s. We both believe(d) that the EU is anti-democratic. I also accept that these days and given recent events in Labour some might argue that to support Labour as it is now is to be racist. However, had I not moved more towards the centre as I have aged and had I for longer been a member of the Labour party I would long since have left the party due to its recent position(s). Although I am now merely centre left I am not a Blairite. To my mind he was closer to being a‘soft Tory’ rather than Labour. That said I did vote for him the first two times he was elected as he was closest to the centre left position I inhabit. I agree with what Ed said early in this thread that Blair totally messed up immigration. That arguably in part led to the Ref result. I believe it to be entirely non sequitur to automatically label those against free movement to be racist. I would be equally against 3 million Brummies or Geordies moving into London in a few short years. Its the numbers and rate of flow that is the problem not race when it comes to Brexit. Far too many of the labels attached insultingly and universally to all Leavers in all Brexit related threads here and on the old MM forum are without any legitimate foundation whatsoever.
Dave for you to (at the outset of all Brexit debate here and elsewhere) have labelled right after I had said I was a Leaver, all Leavers to be “delusional” was quite clearly making things personal. Have some insight, man. I will say no more than – First Blood. The insulting attacks on Leavers of which all knew/know I am one have persisted ever since using the derogatory epithets I listed above and more. I challenge you to review this entire thread and find a single term of insult directed by me or anyone else towards Remainers. But the reverse is perpetual, consistent and plethora. So how dare you attack as if I am the one who has made matters personal.
I am sorry if I took your numerous posts about multiple trips to Europe as meaning more than a single 5 day city break holiday (£35 each way on EasyJet). I do presume that the trip cost you in total far, far more than the air travel which is all that you cite as if to suggest the trip cost very little. Quite some spinning, Dave. Pick the cheapest bit, focus on it. You would be a damn fine SpAd to some Minister.
To put matters straight I never suggested that you were overly affluent. Don’t be so ridiculous. All I suggested was that you have obviously not been smashed by austerity in the same way those needing to use food banks have. Your posts in numerous threads about going to different parts of Europe, to beer festivals, etc., obviously misled me. I trust I do not need to list and cite them all. I suspect those posts misled not merely me but many others here also. That you now explain it was just a single trip costing you no more in total than a few quid to Stavros clearly sets the record straight for all of us.
I believe that the records of all of my posts and those of other are indeed enough to verify all of the above. And the content of Ed’s post immediately above this clearly proves which side indulge in personal attacks – Q.E.D. So now I;m a Moggite when in raility I’m a Benn’ist.
_______________________________________________________________________________________
During the Covid-19 Epidemic I will be wearing a mask and goggles while posting so that if I become infected I won't spread it to you.
February 28, 2019 at 7:41 am #31202Actually if you look at the less easily fiddled Long Term Unemployment figures the trend is now on the upslope. link
Such is untrue as I assume you would/should know. Trends are based in essence on a line of best fit and require established data to extend from. They are not merely forecasts for which no evidence as yet exists. There is as yet no upslope whatsoever. Indeed even the forecasts are for unemployment to fall still further below today’s record low. It is though, I accept, forecast that they will then return from that ‘extra low’ to a level the same as today’s record low. To hold such to be an upslope is, I am sure unintentionally on your part, deceptively misleading.
_______________________________________________________________________________________
During the Covid-19 Epidemic I will be wearing a mask and goggles while posting so that if I become infected I won't spread it to you.
February 28, 2019 at 8:36 am #31204I think I put up Forumite co ltd inc for just this kind of thing ?
February 28, 2019 at 9:33 am #31205I had previously said earlier that there had been little impact so far from the threat of Brexit as no-one knew what form it would take. the recent trend in Long Term Unemployment up by 10% (1.0 to 1.1) is a better reflection of people being unable to find work or being forced into early retirement.
You were referring to trend lines which are quite something else and subject to huge political distortion based on starting and ending points, and do not reflect the current growing uncertainty in the country.
Taking another marker that Brexiteers find uncomfortable, Business Confidence is currently down to a nearly unprecedented negative 23 and if you want a trend line it drops almost linearly from +13 at the start of 2018. This is probably the best proxy for job availability as it reflects the confidence with which businesses will invest and grow new jobs. It is also almost a *linear fall from the pre-Brexit position! link
*if you exclude the actual referendum period outlier.
February 28, 2019 at 2:41 pm #31210Business is unsure because we have not left yet and unemplyment is the lowest since the 70’s ?
February 28, 2019 at 3:35 pm #31211VFM, of course you implying that I was affluent, that was the whole thrust of your post. You even went so far to say that you knew more about suffering than I could! Weasel words. You went too far, again.
My first post mentioning the word delusional was well before all this got nasty, and that is mostly down to you and your attitude. That was when it was a lot of bantering, no-one taking anything too seriously. You really are turning into nothing better than a troll. The more we move away from the sort of Brexit you want the nastier you get.
That’s it, you can say what ever you like about me I’m not going to give you any more fuel. I’m sure you’ll continue to peddle your flawed and biased psuedo-economics. There is no point contesting it, you aren’t able to see the flaws.
March 1, 2019 at 6:58 am #31235Dave, if you cannot see that calling folks delusional is nasty all hope is lost for you. How can you truly say calling people delusional is not an insult.
I stress again all insults have tended to be from Remainers towards Leavers. Tell me, apart from suggesting that you may be better off than some (which is hardly an insult) can you direct me to a single insult I have directed at any Remainer in person or even generically re Remainers. You will find none. I do not descend to such levels. Resorting to such is evidence of a bankrupt mind. Yet Leavers have been subjected to all manner of attacks your last post simply adding to such. Or would you try to suggest your last post was not nasty or insulting either. Calm down, lad, calm down.
_______________________________________________________________________________________
During the Covid-19 Epidemic I will be wearing a mask and goggles while posting so that if I become infected I won't spread it to you.
March 1, 2019 at 11:27 am #31238@VFM I think you are being over-sensitive. You stated that my post, which contained the following was insulting:
“No need to lose your cool, we all understand that Moggites are under enormous stress trying to rationalise their continual spinning and turning in their efforts to find ways of dealing with uncomfortable facts and realities!”
I challenge you to find one insult in it, unless you consider being classified as a Moggite is insulting.(but perhaps you have a point – I would certainly feel insulted).
I consider the statement on Moggite spinning and turning to be accurate – maybe not you personally but certainly Mogg and Bojo have been doing their share.
March 2, 2019 at 6:10 am #31274I’m thinking this is starting to get a bit to heated. Let’s all calm down a bit, maybe get back to being geeks and talking our usual rubbish that normal people won’t talk to us about.
After all, that’s how we all ended up here.
F-the politics, its doesn’t matter which side of the line we fall on, us bickering about it won’t change the direction of the government, or other members minds, and this can only lead to members falling out, and the shrinking of our little family.
Non of us want this, let’s put this down to ‘one of those things’, eveyone has their moments once in a while. I love a rant, more than most, which youre all well aware of I’m sure.
So let’s not fall out gent’s. Lets get back to talking pointless stuff like Linux (shots fired). ?
March 2, 2019 at 11:27 am #31290Linux pointless!!! How dare you………………LOL
_______________________________________________________________________________________
During the Covid-19 Epidemic I will be wearing a mask and goggles while posting so that if I become infected I won't spread it to you.
-
AuthorPosts
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.