Wileyfox.

[Bob Williams]

I am surprised to see the site still accepting my access and still advertising all WF phones. However, a closer look shows every phone in the inventory as “Out of Stock.”

I have emailed them for information: the contact list is still operational. Not too worried about our two phones, both > 2 years old. But Gdaughter’s phone is new.

I will be very surprised to receive an answer.

When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.

[Ed P]

I’m afraid at some point all WF users may have to resort to rooting them in order to get stock Android and its updates. This looks to be the appropriate detructions. Perhaps Steve or someone else who is familiar with the black art of rooting could take a look and advise the best path to follow:

[The Duke]

Ive not rooted a phone since the htc 1 M8, probably 3 years or more.

You’ll need to go over to xda forums and see how well the WS phones are supported. I’d bet they have a little corner over there. With clever folk porting 3rd party roms.

However id advise against romming unless it’s a last resort. Once you had to rom to get the most oit of a phone, now you’ll no doubt make the camera worse, as 3rd parties only have access to the basic aosp camera drivers. All oems now have propriery software for imaging, that is private.

Also a lot of media apps, and others, including banking apps, won’t work on a rooted devices.

Lee will back me up when I say I was a big advocate of root and romming. It was the first thing I’d do with a new device. But the M8 was my last, that is when the cons really outnumbered the pros.

I so miss CM though, better than stock, and way better than anything Samsung htc sony etc…. Ever made. CM improved my Samsung and many htc devices.

Never romed a moto device or WF, the later because it had it baked in.

[Ed P]

Thanks for the forum suggestion. I took a look they seem reasonably well supported including the ‘official’ camera apk. I’ll certainly hold off for now, but it looks like a viable backstop.

[Bob Williams]

Thanks for the links Ed and Steve. I have put both in Firefox Pocket as a possible way out if needed. If I do manage to receive any information from the WF website, and/or an Email reply, I will post results here.

When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.

[Boris]

LATEST NEWS

Wileyfox ‘will continue’ despite administration

Clicky

“We’re restructuring the whole business and will continue,” Coombes said.

“Russian bank Promsvyazbank (PSB) collapsing in December was a surprise, we’ve been forced into this until we can fix it.

“Customer service will continue in regards to repairs and updates. There will be a couple of days where we cease operations due to administrative process.

“Future phone launches will only be pushed back a couple of days, the Wileyfox Pro will be released this month.”

Never trust an atom - they make up everything !

[Bob Williams]

Thanks Boris, that appears to be good news, although some comments there are still worrying. In view of some of those comments: if our  WF phones die, we will be reluctant to replace them with another WF phone. I think the company will struggle now, damage is done.

When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.

[Ed P]

Thanks Boris, I wish WF luck. Their product is well-built both from a software and hardware standpoint. As a new WF owner I’m impressed with both their customer support and their timely security updates. Re damage to the company, I do not  think the average Joe pays that much attention to company business news and that is where WF were pitched – certainly not a bleeding edge techie appealing product. Just solid with a good general choice of specs. I certainly did not get too worried about Russian financing much better that than Middle-East sub-rosa ISIS supporting countries. (most of those being in the footie business!)

[Richard]

I suspect that WF management were caught between a rock and a hard place when it came to financing. With experience they might regret relying on the previous source of finance. What most people would desire from a financier is stability, they did not get that from their Russian bank. Would they have got it elsewhere? I am not sure that they would. Bank financing does not fill me with happiness., relying on a foreign bank would be more likely to cause me nightmares.

I agree with ED on one point, if they can re-establish themselves on the market and with a good campaign behind them, their customer service track record should paper over any cracks. Most punters will not want to know about financial services games.

All of that said, I understood that the bank in question did encounter some uniquely Russian issues, though RBS created some uniquely UK ones and Barclays ploughed (and tilled?) the furrow Ed despises. My previous experience of contact with Russian businesses would make me avoid anything within Russia but everyone’s experience guides them.

[Ed P]

Unfortunately the UK still has one of the world’s poorest infrastructures for innovative financing. It is one reason why companies still like going to the US despite all its associated software patent squatting downsides.

[Richard]

If the grass is really so much greener in the US banking industry perhaps WF should have borrowed there rather than from Russia. With overseas borrowing the foreign exchange risks tend to apply and I think I raised issues about the levels of ‘innovation’ developed by RBS, Halifax Barclays et al. I knew a company accountant who brought out the head office accounts need for smelling salts years back via his then ‘innovation’ of placing short term spare cash on overnight deposit.

How well your eulogy sits with the USA banking innovation of such bold ideas as Ninja mortgages and all the other banking issues across the pond is another issue all together. In this regard the banking and stock exchange bubble travails of Japan with its innovation of re-cycling loan securities also deserve a noteworthy mention – that also did not end well when the bubble burst.

Sometimes a little more banking balance and a bit less commission hunting could be a superior answer, what is wrong with some equity financing where the investor punts the cash, carries the risk and hopes to make a return?

 

[Bob Williams]

I don’t have any input to offer in the discussion between you, Ed and Richard, as High Finance is not my forte. However, I can answer this, Richard:

” ...what is wrong with some equity financing where the investor punts the cash, carries the risk and hopes to make a return? ”

I’ll tell you what is wrong with that scenario: it is when a family gets a small windfall just before the brown & smelly hit the rotating object of UK and world finance. The result was a loss of >50% and it has taken until very recently to replace just about 50% of the 50%.

If I won the Lottery Big One this week, there is no way on this corrupt, capitalist-driven planet that I would dip my toes into investment again.

When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.

[Tippon]

Bob Williams wrote:

If I won the Lottery Big One this week, there is no way on this corrupt, capitalist-driven planet that I would dip my toes into investment again.

I’d treat investments in the same way that Steve says he treats bets in the other thread – I’d consider the money gone as soon as the investment was made, and anything that comes back would be a bonus. Maybe not the ‘best’ way to handle it, but probably the best way to do it without getting overly stressed.

[Richard]

No bob, like me you should not punt more than a tiny proportion of risk ‘capital’, – currently my proportion is zero. That is why I shall probably also make a gain of close to zero. Punting on wild shots is NOT for small investors, I am not even a small investor.

It is late, I am not at my best, good night.

[Ed P]

“If the grass is really so much greener in the US banking industry perhaps WF should have borrowed there rather than from Russia”

Richard the US banking system is even worse than ours! You do not borrow from banks but from venture capital companies, these  pretty much requires you set up your company there, that would expose WF to all sorts of spurious ‘look & feel’ patent claims. Not really practical for them.

[Ed P]

I sympathise with Bob, Unfortunately he was probably a victim of the IFA money grubbers who just wanted to continue milking their no-risk (to them) 2-5% fee structure. All the warning signs were blinking bright red at the time but there were very few voices willing to state the obvious  – that the dam was about to burst and preferentially destroy all those who came late to the party. It wasn’t helped by Gordon Brown’s actions to pillage pension funds, a move that could not have come at a worse time, but typical of a man who sold out our gold reserves at their lowest possible price.

There were very similar warning signs flashing just a few months ago when we previously touched on stock market risk, and I mentioned Warren Buffett’s predictions that the current dam was about to burst and send us into a full-blown Bear Market. I do not think we have yet seen the worst of that forecast. as Price/Earnings ratios are still at a stupidly high level, and we have yet to see the full negative effects of Brexit – whatever that word is supposed to mean.

[Richard]

Ed, it is not so easy to cherry pick from what appears to pass for a system in other countries. We have our own ‘financial services issues’, the USA has their own financial/legal ‘system’ issues as does, for example Japan, et al. While vulture capital companies exist in other jurisdictions with the USA having ‘Venture Vultures’ to boot. Raising cash on such as AIM or as a private share or bond sale which has been a regulated industry that has been used here for years, usually small investors are barred. The point is that a bank would not be my prime choice for finance in any country.The problem is that a bank can recall the loan at any point leaving the borrower high and dry, other finance methods can usually be free of such problems.

In fact with the exception of a mortgage taken out in 1975 and paid off by 1980 I cannot recall taking out any loans in this country. While overseas I did buy a BMW via a series of promissory notes signed over to the dealer, which they later discounted with a bank when the dealer wanted cash in a hurry. I then bought them back from the bank. As an aside, my UK bank told me that I had been a very naughty boy as the then Labour Government had tight exchange rules which the UK bank thought could/should restrict foreign loans.  As I was paid in currency had signed the notes in that currency, the deal had no UK involvement plus the matter had almost concluded and I had not technically had a loan anyway, I considered that issue moot.

[Author]

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