New Electric Vehicles only from 2030

[PlaneMan]

So Boris has done it, no new petrol or diesel cars or vans in the UK from 2030.

Generally I think it’s a good idea but only 10 years to sort out the infrastructure is, IMO, nowhere near enough. Look at the state of broadband in rural areas still.

The cost needs to come down and the range needs to go up. A little reported fact is at motorway speeds range drops of a cliff on most EVs.  Also cold weather can have a big impact on range.

For someone like me with no drive at home and needs to use disabled parking charging at the supermarket/shopping centre isn’t viable. At the moment I’ve only seen chargers in the further away areas of car parks and they are all  slow chargers.  Something like a Renault Zoe would take 8 hours to charge, if not more.

There are no super fast chargers anywhere near me and only a couple of ‘rapid’ ones which are normally in use as they are at car dealerships.

Then there’s the cost. The initial price is so much more than a conventional car but the maintenance is almost nothing and if you can charge at home/work for cheap ‘fuel’ is much, much cheaper.

If you lease then the monthly cost can be offset by the saving on fuel. If you buy outright, like me, then the extra cost is a huge factor, I’d need to almost double what I paid for my current car to get a lightly used E 208 which is the closest pure electric car to mine, and the range is a bit rubbish, about 155 miles in the real world or 100 at any decent speed. That wouldn’t get me to Bristol Airport and back unless I did 50 mph all the way and then it would be way to close a call.

 

 

[Dave Rice]

Yes lots of work still to do. It’s not just the charging points it’s what feeds them too. The whole power distribution infrastructure needs a lot of work doing to it and it’s not going to be cheap.

[Ed P]

Not only that, Government has to bang heads in the car industry and tell them that they MUST standardise the charging system to iso 155118-2. The industry is procrastinating at the public’s expense.

link

[edit] PM have a look around at your local Tesco, they seem to be adding charging points to bays near the store.

[JayCeeDee]

When I bought my car in April 2019 I looked to see if there were viable EV or Hybrid options. The B Class had a hybrid B250e, but the equipment level was basic and the price was dearer than the equivalent fully loaded diesel model .

Their new EQ range is out now, but starting at £56k or thereabouts it’s way out of most people’s reach. If they want us to go electric, they have to start financially motivating both manufacturers and consumers.

If they are really intending to meet some of the eco targets they’ve set themselves, they need to do things like lose the VAT on eco products, whether that is EV’s, hybrids or solar panels. They have to stop dicking around at the margins and make some hard choices.

[PlaneMan]

Ed, the local Tesco has had 4 chargers foe a while,they are within a reasonable distance of the shop but too far for me. They are only 7KW ones as well, the same power as a home wall box. So about 8 hours for a e 208. They are free though.

JCD, not long ago in France it was possible to get a brand new Renault Zoe for 10 euros a month due to a massive lump of cash to get people into EV’s. Who wouldn’t do that? The sensible car for boring day to day stuff, which is most of it, and the fun car for longer journeys and for the sake of it, even if it’s a hire car.

[keith with the teef]

I have a pencil and paper with me and being one of the few on the planet with a large brain, I will solve this problem.

I have a briliant idea and I shall call it Pantograph.

[JayCeeDee]

PlaneMan wrote:

JCD, not long ago in France it was possible to get a brand new Renault Zoe for 10 euros a month due to a massive lump of cash to get people into EV’s.

That’s exactly what I mean. It won’t take long for people en masse to take them up on that sort of offer. Unfortunately, our lot over here think the way to go is to penalise you for owning an internal combustion engine’d car and hope you’ll see EV’s as a cheaper way out!! :wacko: :scratch:

[Ed P]

If you read the rumour mill, the Treasury are already woriied at the £40Bn loss of petrol/diesel duty and VAT caused by EVs. Talk of a car mileage charge e.g. mileage reported at each MOT then the Government levies a mileage charge to be paid during the next year..

[PlaneMan]

Ed, I saw that this morning, half asleep.

Forgot about it until you just mentioned it.

The facts are simple, the treasury makes a shit load of motorists. They will claw that back after 20 30, one way or another.

I don’t object to paying for journeys I don’t need to do, as long as it’s a sensible, affordable, amount. And I pay once per journey.

As a knackered person who increasingly will need to do more journeys for my mum and her fella, how the hell will they tell the difference between necessary and fun?

Roll a ten sided die probably, more likely outsource it to Capita or someone similar, they don’t have any history of causing death or massive hardship to people who have been denied PIP because their staff are incompetent. 😢

 

[JayCeeDee]

Ed P wrote:

Talk of a car mileage charge e.g. mileage reported at each MOT then the Government levies a mileage charge to be paid during the next year..

That would give the old ‘Clockers’ a new lease of life!!!

I was about to say, either that or disconnect the speedo cable, but I’m just showing my age with that one!!! :scratch: :wacko:

There’s so much of the auto electronics tied in with the car’s speed moving down the road, from ABS to ESP to tyre pressure etc you would lose a large proportion of the safety features. 🙁

But you’re right, they won’t stand lightly for that loss, they’ll find a way to claw it back when they should be paying us for helping them meet their eco targets.

[Boris]

“from ABS to ESP to tyre pressure etc”

A car with ESP ? Extrasensory Perception ? Wow ! My old 2003 Agila will have to go to the scrapyard ASAP now 🙂

Never trust an atom - they make up everything !

[JayCeeDee]

Boris wrote:

A car with ESP ?

ESP stand for Electronic Stability Program, at least in the Mercedes-Benz dictionary. It uses input from several sensor to help stabilize the car during cornering, over steering, under steering or slipping. … This is done by monitoring the rotation speed of each wheel using the ABS sensors on the wheel.

Extrasensory Perception ? Wow ! My old 2003 Agila will have to go to the scrapyard ASAP now 🙂

It knew what you were going to do in the back seat before you did.

Bit like the old joke :- “My girlfriend’s a witch!!” “How do you know??” “She whispered the magic words in my ear and I turned into a layby!!” :yahoo:

 

 

[Wheels-Of-Fire]

Total, utter, unachievable, bo**ocks.

If the Government intends to press ahead with its zero carbon electricity generation targets then we won’t have enough power to keep the lights on, let alone charge millions of cars.

Pie in the sky ecomentallist pleasing nonsense.

IMHO of course 🤣

[Drezha]

Wheels-Of-Fire wrote:

Total, utter, unachievable, bo**ocks. If the Government intends to press ahead with its zero carbon electricity generation targets then we won’t have enough power to keep the lights on, let alone charge millions of cars. Pie in the sky ecomentallist pleasing nonsense. IMHO of course 🤣

Doesn’t matter – won’t be this Government’s issue to deal with :whistle:

"Everything looks interesting until you do it. Then you find it’s just another job" - Terry Pratchett

[Ed P]

They just have to do Engineering Inspections on all the existing nuclear plants, give them another 15 years and no probs — other than maybe a few glow in the dark folk around the Severn Estuary!

Just joking, I actually think the dangers from nuclear radiation are grossly exaggerated, As a small child I played around with radium paint to no ill effect. Most of the Fukashima radiation exposures were less than that experienced in Cornwall, and despite a catastrophic event Chernoble caused very few direct or indirect deaths.

[JayCeeDee]

The current problem needing attention is CO2, hence the need for an alternative to Fossil Fuels. Safety has improved vastly, just over the last few decades. Nuclear generating could fill the gap until Science comes up with a way of dealing with, or better still utilising, the waste.

So long as there are no kickbacks or shortcuts that endanger the construction or safety of nuclear generating plants, and Governments really are serious about getting rid of fossil fuel generating, they could be an easier way forward to our greener future.

( Greenpeace would need to accept they can’t have it all ways and accept the CO2 win.) They would certainly meet the increased capacity needed in a future with more EV’s.

[The Duke]

I’ve seen many charging stations pop up latley. Was having s weekend away in the middle of Wales and even there tiny Tesco had 4 points.

However they need to be super high capacity charging points like the Tesla ones to make it work. Think fast charging on your phone, you don’t need 400m range oif you  can charge 150 miles in 20 mins.

All the charging stations are is big are capacitors that can push Hugh of power quickly.

I’d quite like a Nissan leaf tbh, or similar, as on the whole I drive about 9 miles round trip. Evey now and then I’ll to a 100 mile round trip.

[Wheels-Of-Fire]

Speaking of CO2, as a greenhouse gas its a bit rubbish.

Not up there with Methane or Water vapour in effectiveness and not really “up there” much at all because it is heavier than air and tends to stick around ground level where it CAN’T produce a greenhouse effect.

The amount of CO2 at ground level has  increased  greatly since the start of the industrial revolution and is now running at a massive 0.04 %.

 

[Wheels-Of-Fire]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aircraft_Nuclear_Propulsion

As a solution to CO2 in the upper atmosphere caused by jet engines, how about the above ?

Not only would it eliminate the CO2 emissions it would also greatly reduce demand by eliminating the passengers too 😆

[The Duke]

If they have cracked selfdriving cars by then (or whenever they do) the days of  ownership of a car will be over.

As a father of teens (and young adults ) I’d happily have a family plan for a set fee. Just so my kids don’t me to take and bring them back from places.

Also be the end of taxis, this is Ubers end game btw. Uber or whoever owns it’s by 2035 ish (Facebook) will be the only game in town.

That way FB will actually own us all.

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