After Manchester Terrorist its London Again

[blacklion1725]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40165646

……….so not home grown…….and very definitely deportable if any one running our country had an ounce of guts or decency. To my mind there are strong grounds for those who have deliberately let these lot (and the others) stay at large to face criminal charges – it is disgusting how they are failing us. We know who they are – estimates are around 3,000 – and we let them live, thrive and survive.

[Ed P]

The UK has a long history of harbouring unsavoury characters, much to the annoyance at times by other nations. Cynically I think we used to hold a view that it was better to have them inside the tent peeing out, rather than the other way round. IF this is a reflection of the ‘realpolitik’ then it obviously needs to be reviewed. We also need to sensitively review the grounds we apply for political asylum – this is a very difficult area in that some may have genuine grounds despite fleeing from an apparently stable country. I have in mind for example Muslim apostates who face certain death in some ‘civilised’ countries. Some way must be found to both test their stated grounds for asylum and monitor them during a probationary period.

I have to say that these are not the only people of concern. The ones we should really worry about are the ones we do not know about, who have been smuggled into the country through our very porous sea borders (we have a laughable number of coast guard cutters for our extent of shoreline). Perhaps we need to look once again at National ID cards as a way of culling out the illegals, or we need to clamp down on everyday existing documentation e.g. Tax Identification Number, Health, National Insurance, driver Licence, Birth Certificate etc Roll all these into one and intern any who have not got all of a given set of base docs.

[blacklion1725]

We knew plenty about this one Ed – he was on a national TV documentary with an ISIS flag and yet was at liberty to commit mass murder.

[Ed P]

I do not disagree with the sentiments, but is it actually an illegal act to display an ISIS flag? If not the law needs a change pdq.

I’m afraid I have to lay all this at the door of May. When she was Home Secretary she looked to do things on the cheap, and was conned into thinking all you have to do is electronically spy on people more effectively. She jumped at this option and sacked half our police force as a result. No doubt there were warning flags being posted up all over the place by the automated systems, but some poor barsteward had to triage them all and do their very best with their extremely limited manpower.

I’ll get my revenge at the ballot box, and I suspect a lot of others will too. May could well teeter right on the edge of defeat. The smell of blood is leaking from the ‘Submarine’

[Richard]

Ed P wrote:

I do not disagree with the sentiments, but is it actually an illegal act to display an ISIS flag? If not the law needs a change pdq. I’m afraid I have to lay all this at the door of May. When she was Home Secretary she looked to do things on the cheap, and was conned into thinking all you have to do is electronically spy on people more effectively. She jumped at this option and sacked half our police force as a result. No doubt there were warning flags being posted up all over the place by the automated systems, but some poor barsteward had to triage them all and do their very best with their extremely limited manpower. I’ll get my revenge at the ballot box, and I suspect a lot of others will too. May could well teeter right on the edge of defeat. The smell of blood is leaking from the ‘Submarine’

Was that the same May who got rid of Captain Hook after he beat back such as ‘plastic policeman’ Blunkett when he tried to remove him over the years?

Do you really think Dianne Abyss and the terrorists friend have a cup of tea my friend Corbyn would do anything better – except pick you pocket?

Think nose and face first once the hysteria dies down.

[Richard]

blacklion1725 wrote:

We knew plenty about this one Ed – he was on a national TV documentary with an ISIS flag and yet was at liberty to commit mass murder.

It surprises me that he was free to roam after so many anti terror bills, was it one every 24 months since 2000? Not to mention all the race hate laws and restriction of speech laws; this pile of pig poo was still able to skate round the law scot free. Some serious, rational thought is needed to block off their escape from justice (wots justice?), the Criminal Protection Service will soon let them off anyway.

I can imagine if half of what he had said and done was directed by someone else in the direction of his kind there would have been a hue and cry heard across the world. That is going to be an emerging, serious issue as it leads to resentment.

[Ed P]

I found the answer to my own question – it was illegal. The only answer to why he was not arrested is that we do not have enough police to do the job in a proper manner.

May cannot be trusted to run the country on her own, and certainly is not a demonstrably safe pair of hands for Brexit. To answer your question Richard no, I and others in the South will not be voting for Corbyn (and certainly not the numerically challenged History graduate), but neither will the Conservative party get a smooth ride.

A hung parliament would be a much safer option for the country and prevent insanities by either the left or right.

[dwynnehugh]

Can I just clarify what May did – she forced police officers who had completed their 30 year stint to resign under a section of the police laws (can’t remember which one – could be S18 of the Police Disc Code) – these were of course the most experienced officers and also the most expensive to employ. In fairness any of these officers could have put their ticket in at any time it suited them – of course many would have continued until their required retirement age – 58yrs for Constable and Sergeants.

Of course if you get rid of experience the youngsters have nobody to refer to. The money save in this way was to have been used to employ more officers – whether it did or not is another matter.

The more you meet people the more you understand why Noah took animals instead of humans

[blacklion1725]

To be honest I think we have reached the unfortunate stage where we can’t look at the traditional approach of “have they committed a crime”. We can’t apply western democratic logic to this mob. If there is intelligence on 3000 or to suggest that they even sympathise with this ideology then they should be detained. Those not born here should be deported, forgetting any potential issues of their country of birth. Those born here detained – charged if possible and if not detained indefinitely or offered a move to the Islamic country of their choice (if one will accept them). We have been soft, they have seen that we are soft, and they exploit that weakness with tragic consequences. Yes we also need to look at the huge numbers coming in to the country, and why they are choosing the UK over an Islamic country. On both fronts it is clear that carrying on as we are and hoping it will all come out in the wash isn’t working. Time to change and get on the front foot.

[Bob Williams]

I look back to my own time in the Middle East and conversations with native peoples there. I recall the consensus of opinion that we (“The West”, but particualarly Brits) were regarded as weak for showing mercy when taking prisoners and generally dealing with those we met in a humane manner. I believe that conception of our values, has increased exponentially as we have been more and more bound by political correctness and the growth of liberal feeling from certain organisations in this country. In short, the “do-gooders” are letting us down and tying down the arms of those who wish to protect us.

I initially felt that Teresa May could have been the PM we needed, but after several more U-turns than even Cameron contemplated, I cannot vote for her and I certainly cannot vote for our local MP, who has proved to be a pale shadow of Sir Peter Tapsell, the Traditional Independent Tory * MP. The rememberance of how TM emasculated the Police Service as Home Secretary, has reinforced my opinion. On that note, Dwynne: what she did to the Police Service, is no more than what was done by successive governments of all flavours, to our Armed Forces. Added to which, those Armed Forces have been sent to take action in wars which cannot be won, on falsely-created reasons, thus creating many more enemies. Bombing the carp out of people does not win Hearts and Minds.

*   He was given that description by a local constituent at his Surgery in my hearing. His answer was “Does that make me a TIT?”

Cue LOLz from several constituents, including myself. Sir Peter was and is a real character, they do not exist in Westminster anymore.

When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.

[Ed P]

Dwynne, the outgoing Met Police Commissioner spelt out in an interview that Met Police cuts were scheduled to carry on for the next two or three years. Feb 2017. May cannot pretend that she was not warned that her cuts have real consequences.

I liked his comment ‘”You need cops. You can’t throw laptops at crowds.”. This reveals that the Government has foolishly bet that technology and masses of irrelevant data can substitute for manpower and human intelligence.

It is also clear from passing  comments on the three London murderers that low level resource allocations have been made when it came to decisions to follow up on given intelligence. If there is only one slot left for surveillance then someone would have to be carrying a box labelled ‘Instruments of Death’ before some poor sod could be certain they had made the correct decision. I do not blame the Met for failures I blame May’s ill-thought strategy and her unsafe handling.

[Bob Williams]

Ed P wrote:

I do not blame the Met for failures I blame May’s ill-thought strategy and her unsafe handling.

TM’s idea of crime and criminals is a hazy, nostalgic picture of a masked man in a striped jersey with a large bag marked “Swag” over his shoulder. Unfortunately the nostalgia does not cover the number of police officers during those days….

And this is a pithy, accurate assessment: ‘”You need cops. You can’t throw laptops at crowds.” I also like that.

When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.

[dwynnehugh]

I think that one of the biggest myths in the UK is that there was a time when Dixon of Dock Green ever existed.

There wasn’t.

The more you meet people the more you understand why Noah took animals instead of humans

[Ed P]

There was a very interesting piece on Radio 4 this morning that unfortunately does not appear to be available on iPlayer. In this two security specialists went over all the terrorist incidents and for the first time to my knowledge pointed out the obvious. All the recent murderers and arrested terrorists were of Arabic extraction, all were Sunni Muslims and all belonged to one of the extremists sects that can be lumped together as Wahhabi Salafists. They then went on to say that the absence of local officers impeded intelligence collection, They recognised the difficulty of directly inserting plain clothes officers into this environment, but said that the indirect intelligence from beat PCs/PCSOs could have filled some gaps.

A Beeb clip last night showed film taken last year on how one of the whistle blowers of the London murderers suffered criminal assault at a gathering of the local sect. Despite complaining to the Police and Anti-Terrorist Branch there was no follow-up even though this should apparently have raised the terrorists profile into one prone to using violence. I guess lack of resources and prioritisation were to blame, and all on May’s watch as Home Secretary.

Earlier that same evening I went to a local (non-political) Residents Meeting and the crowd were absolutely incensed at the Police cuts that had taken place in the local area. They demanded the Committee take action – fat chance of that doing any good. Luckily one of the Committee pointed out they could take their own action at the Ballot box on Thursday.

This is all adding up to be a torrid time for May.

[blacklion1725]

On a positive note in the middle of all this tragedy (body washed up at Limehouse today and many victims still critical in hospital) – fair play to this bloke – even if he does support that lot! The press love a story like this but just heard an interview with him from his hospital bed, and he told it very calmly with no sensationalism, and typical bit of British humour, even those these scum sliced him to bits.

Listening to the interview this happened just before the police turned up and shot the murderers (outside) – so I think he has saved a good many from death and injury. Piling in to three terrorists – who were wearing bomb vests and armed with 12″ knives – as one of the comments says he should never have to buy another pint.

The interviewer asked him about his injuries, they have sewn his ear lobe back on and he has already had some plastic surgery – his main comment was “I can still lift a pint glass” – as I say – fair play!

What a contrast between a real man and the cowards who attack the innocent and the unarmed.

[Tippon]

BL: Someone shared a photo on Twitter earlier – his friends bought him a book called ‘Learn to Run’ ???

[Ed P]

One of the terrorists wore an Arsenal shirt which is no doubt why he lost his rag!

[Ed P]

When you  cannot “run & hide” this bit of advice via Microsoft may help save lives. It deserves a wider circulation.

Ex SAS Soldier’s Advice

[Bob Williams]

I was one of those sent to N.I. in ’69 when the Troubles kicked – off. Then, as now, there were never enough troops: more than now, but the Armed Forces had more on their tactical plate then. As a result, being Para trained, I was part of an unruly mob of Service Arms that stood with infantry, artillery, REME, Signals and RE’s to keep the Prods and Kaffliks apart. Before we went, they gave us some very useful stuff and some absolutely ridiculous stuff. The useful stuff was Aikido training with sticks and batons. However, they stopped us doing that when the N.I. hospital wards became crammed with broken bones: basic Aikido (and it was very basic) means attacking areas of the body where bones or joints are near the surface. Skulls, collarbones, shoulder joints, elbows, wrists, hips, knees, ankles and down onto feet arches and toes if they are daft enough to participate in a riot wearing sandals or flip flops. (Believe me, some did.)

It was effective and it broke up riots, but when they stopped it, the ridiculous stuff came in. What the public call “rubber bullets” – actually large plastic baton rounds, fired from a one-shot weapon like a big, short shotgun. Strikes to the torso caused some deaths and serious injury to internal organs, which was what the use of baton rounds were supposed to prevent! We were told to fire at the floor close to the leading rioters. This added ridiculousness led to even more serious injury, as the baton rounds came up from underneath bodies and struck certain soft parts. It was realised back in the early 70’s that this was an undeclared war we could not win, so we were back to rifles: high velocity 7.62mm SLR’s, a round from which could possibly travel 9 miles and go through a one-course brick wall. Just what you need in a dense urban area!

Back to the Aikido: I learned a few years ago how useful my alloy elbow crutch can be in a threatening situation. “Old disabled man with stick” became ‘”That old B*****d has broken my arm!” It stopped my attacker dead when I rammed it into his abdomen, then brought it down on his elbow joint. I had to buy a new stick afterwards, but it was worth it. The officers called by a passerby could not hide their amusement.

At the time, I was skint, awaiting DLA and Incapacity tribunal decision. I had a fiver in my wallet, no cards and a few coins in my pocket, but I would not have given the scumbag a bent 1p piece. I will always stand up to scum: if we all did, they would be history.

When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.

[The Duke]

Do that today bob and TM would of never given you DLA lol

The rules of engagement are just as fun, I recall my days, only engage if your life is in danger, them firing is not enough, they have to be firing at you! And if you engage you get to fight your own battles in court.

At least the Americans would have you out of the country and we’ll protected. Not good old UK.

Ffw 20 years, my BiL on his way out the raf now, was on gard last month, they got the whole rules of engagement spiel (as you do each time) , then sent to zero their weapons, then was told they was no longer allowed to carry weapons while on guard,  if they are fire upon to call for help.

Sooo… Yeh…. Let’s not tell the bad guys as there are many unguarded large stockpiles of arms around the country. Given he is in the raf, alot of unguarded jets and helos to boot.

Saying that we probably won’t have any in 10 years time to pretend to guard.

[Author]

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