Forumite Members › General Topics › Other Stuff › Cannabis Helps Old Pharts learn new things!
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Ed P.
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May 9, 2017 at 12:26 pm #7124
While not particularly good news for the young, the latest medical research (in the scientific journal Nature) shows that regular (small) consumption of the active constituents of Cannabis rejuvenate old brain cells back to the way they performed at peak.
The bad news is the research was only done on mice (where do I put my name down as a volunteer tester!). The good news is that it is just another piece of evidence that we have really stupid and unscientific drug laws in the UK.
[edit] forgot the link – I really do need this stuff!
May 9, 2017 at 2:31 pm #7127Now that medical testing on THC has been legalised in the US we should see lots of interesting studies coming out over the next few years.
May 9, 2017 at 2:56 pm #7129I miss my weekly dose of MM 😉 :yahoo:
May 9, 2017 at 4:18 pm #7133Now that medical testing on THC has been legalised in the US we should see lots of interesting studies coming out over the next few years.
I do not think anyone is unaware of the effects of cannabis on the brain of different species. I certainly agree that there are many who have been helped and though some would say they only claim to have been helped. I suspect that the assistance they received is more than the so called placebo effect. those with some specific medical conditions report equally specific benefits and good quality research is to be welcomed. Many drugs in use today have been developed from plants, heroin was the only way to manage some pains, though equally some have found less favourable uses in addition to any health applications.
The flip side of the issue is that equally some people have had less positive encounters with cannabis’s psychoactive attributes. This may result from a range of issues, age, weight, other drugs and conditions or their genetics. Sadly some I knew are no longer around to check, one graduated to cocaine and other substances. After killing his daughter in an accident, he died a little later from ‘life style issues’. The dead girl was a class mate of my eldest.
Another was a classmate of mine, he last one year at University, he started on soft drugs and soon lost the plot. I saw him during the summer vacation. He did not expect to see the next spring and I doubt he did. He spilled out his regrets in a torrent that probably lasted less than ten or fifteen minutes. It left me deeply affected, his final words to me were:
‘don’t let it happen to you.’
So far it is something I have avoided.
May 9, 2017 at 6:35 pm #7137There is no black & white side to the cannabis argument. It is now inarguable, not from this as yet unproven research but from many sources, that there are medical benefits to be obtained in certain cases. Then there is this:
And this, from Oxford University:
There has to be a clear distinction made between actual prescription drugs in tablet or liquid form, and the kind of activity which is currently occupying a great deal of police time and effort. The criminal activity which is producing most of the leaf cannabis, eventually finances harder, more dangerous and more lucrative drugs, besides having the same effects upon the lungs of regular smokers, as tobacco. It also causes psychosis, wrecks lives, breaks up families and communities and finances all kinds of organised criminal activity. Legalising cannabis could place production in the hands of licensed factories. Those dumb enough to smoke this stuff could then provide the HMRC with revenue through taxation. Just like the remaining hard-core tobacco smokers. Both sets of smokers ignore years of medical evidence and are therefore living proof of their own stupidity.
I am reminded of two people, one a Weed smoker, another using tobacco. The spliff smoker was actually driving, windows open, two kids in the back seat (unbelted), a baby in the front. I could smell the weed as she passed my own open car window, did a 180, checked the plate as she drove into Tesco, followed her in and parked, then reported her on the phone without any remorse. I pointed out the car when the police arrived, they went in and came out with her. Minus the 3 kids, who were all still in the car, in Summer heat, windows closed, which was an added item in the report call by me. This made the local media at the time some years ago and the kids were apparently given in full custody to dad and his new lady. I don’t regret that.
The ciggy smoker was a mother of 3 and smoking heavily. She was a close friend to my son at one time, before he wised up. I saw her smoking in town and said, “Those things will kill you!” Her answer was, “I could get run over by a bus! Everybody has to die sometime!” To which I replied “Ah but would you pay the bus driver to run over you, then when you are discharged from hospital, keep paying him until it kills you?” I received an uncomprehending look, then “You’re weird, you!”
And I have been a smoker of cig’s (stopped 40 years ago this year) I also tried a spliff. Once. It did nothing for me. :negative:
But if there is a chance to revive some of my fading neural pathways….. Gimme the pills! :yahoo:
When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.May 9, 2017 at 7:37 pm #7141Cannabis has been completely legal (ALL activities) in Uruguay for getting on for four years, some 23 US States have relaxed controls to various extents. Around the world the position is mixed with some surprises to me. Spain!!!
There SHOULD by now be enough evidence to make a considered unbiased scientific analysis of the data coming out of all this. Unfortunately this seems not to be the case as most of the analysis I have seen has been biased (both ways) by the various researchers, to the extent that it is obvious that some of the researchers have been going in with a predetermined position. Discussion about drug legislation almost takes on a religious mantle – one argument against decriminalising actually said ‘The Pope would not like it!’.
About the only aspect that seems to generate little argument is the over-riding economic argument – it saves the Government money, and might help reduce more serious crime. link
May 9, 2017 at 7:52 pm #7142I wasn’t referring to smoking it Richard. Its a plant that is suspected of having alot of goodness hidden away in it. It is still not full mapped out just. Medical testing was band many decades ago. Now that I he rules have been loosened, there is going to be many studies.
Also i dont really agree that pot is a gateway drug, no more than alcohol is. most people grow out of pot by the time they hit there early 20s, myself I was 16 as i joined the marines, when I left the majority of my friends, that did smoke it (everyone) had stopped.
The ones that carried on, and progressed, are also the ones that drink alot and bet alot. It’s not the pot that was the issue, it’s there “addictive” personality. Still smoke it, take other stuff and are alcohols,
Most people get careers , and/or family and the drugs, and excess drinking comes to a natural end.
Ether way it matters little what you or I, think of the drug itself, testing will be done, and more than likely pills will be made from it. A new potent plant can only be a good thing. It should never of been band from testing in the first place in the US. It makes no sense. As has been said, opium isn’t illegal to test on.
May 9, 2017 at 8:02 pm #7143Ed I’m a big supper of the government giving heroin away, in control houses.
It would cost under half the amount per person to give then heroin than it costs to police it.
If you was to give it away, it would make the street price of the drug worthless, so dealers would stop selling it, and that would have the effect of dealers not forcing people to take it, so no more (or very little new addicts)
So the addict that we have, would get free heroin x times a day (I don’t know how regular is normal), they could be offers councillors to get them off it, or simply live there lives on it untill they die.
The outcome is the same, within a decade or two there will be no heroin addicts. Better than that, with in a month or two, or the start of such a programme, heroin related crimes would end.
It’s win win win, legalise it for 20 years, and the problem fixes itself. Ban it for 100,and you’ll still have the problem in 100 years and you’ll of been paying 2 the about to police it per year, than you would being proactive.
Sell free heroin to all “scum” just can’t be sold on a manifesto, so all theses “scum” will never get true help.
Even if you don’t care for the addicts, the numbers add up and far out perform the “head in sand” option. So it should be a no brainer, but no party would dare try it.
May 9, 2017 at 11:25 pm #7148I gave up trying to work out why drugs where not legalised years ago. There are so many reasons/ benefits as to why they should. What would happen if the PM declared all drugs to be legalised? Drug dealers would have to make a living somehow. Its not going to happen that they can all earn a honest living like the rest of us. I think murders would increase but the biggest increase would imo be in bank robberies? There lies the answer as to why drugs will never be legalised. Those that run the country want to protect there money. When money becomes extinct and banks are no longer on the high street ( post offices nearly all gone) that’s when drugs will become legal. I read a study into hemp not so long back ( cant recall who / why /when) although the guardian done a piece (https://www.theguardian.com/society/2017/feb/04/hemp-plant-that-could-boost-americas-economy) which scratched around the paper I read. For all the goodness cannabis can do why would it not be legal to use / grow.
May 10, 2017 at 7:06 am #7151As we have specific receptors for cannabis hard wired into all our brains (well at least those with a touch of Neanderthal!) there seems to me to be an evolutionary connection between hemp and humans – for good or ill.
Picking up on Steve’s point with respect to different ‘types’ of people, there are definite links between different races and different ailments (For example Nordic types are more susceptible to plague). This also applies to mental illnesses with many showing a racial bias. Unfortunately the likelihood of forming addictions also seems to run on racial lines all of which makes any study very difficult to design and likely to be subject to criticism.
May 10, 2017 at 7:28 am #7152Which of the historic acts would you chose to repeal to return the country to the then status quo?
1868 – Pharmacy Act. First regulation of poisons and dangerous substances. Limited sales to chemists.
1908 – Poisons and Pharmacy Act. Regulations on sale and labelling, including coca.
1916 – Defence of the Realm Act 1914 (Regulation 40B). Sale and possession of cocaine restricted to “authorised persons”.
1920 – Dangerous Drugs Act. Limited production, import, export, possession, sale and distribution of opium, cocaine, morphine or heroin to licensed persons.
1925 – Dangerous Drugs Act. Controlled importation of coca leaf and cannabis.
1928 – Amendment to Dangerous Drugs Act criminalising possession of cannabis. Doctors continued to be able to prescribe any drugs as treatments, including for addiction.The 1964 act complied with UN resolutions of the time. There was a time when drugs and other poisons were totally unregulated, the above acts were a response to the ‘then’ problems which arose.
Would those ‘then’ problems re-emerge to mingle with the current crop of ‘difficulties’. Acid and corrosive liquid throwing is the latest craze gaining traction.
May 10, 2017 at 7:28 am #7153Just to add again to Steve’s comment, one other more or less universal finding from the researchers is that cannabis is NOT a gateway drug though if it is more easily obtained then it is more widely used. (obvious really!)
Richard’s response came in while I was posting but I’d decriminalise the lot and spend the money saved on rehabilitation and education.
Laws are introduced for a variety of reasons – could one of these have been the close connection between MP’s Board memberships of distilleries and breweries, or the vogue at those times for all forms of Prohibition?
Sometimes it is better to address the cause of a problem rather than its symptoms. I do not think cannabis has ever been a ’cause’.
May 10, 2017 at 7:40 am #7155As we have specific receptors for cannabis hard wired into all our brains (well at least those with a touch of Neanderthal!) there seems to me to be an evolutionary connection between hemp and humans – for good or ill. Picking up on Steve’s point with respect to different ‘types’ of people, there are definite links between different races and different ailments (For example Nordic types are more susceptible to plague). This also applies to mental illnesses with many showing a racial bias. Unfortunately the likelihood of forming addictions also seems to run on racial lines all of which makes any study very difficult to design and likely to be subject to criticism.
Very true, many current drugs can be contra indicated for some races and for some with known conditions, (there is a clear genetic relationship to those inherited traits). Members of my family show a range of abnormal responses to otherwise standard treatments as a result. Managing this issue is a very hot potato in medical research circles at the moment. It is far wider than such well known issues as lactose intolerance of certain races/ethnicities. I had not heard of Nordic races being more susceptible to plague – though I also understand there are multiple strains of plague. Could their greater susceptibility be down to fewer having been culled by previous outbreaks due to their greater physical distribution and lesser human concentrations in built up areas in the past? Some studies suggest that it was a greater issue in the UK where other health problems were encountered, such as poor housing, previous illness and chest issues caused by damp and contaminated fetid air from the combustion of various fuels for heating and cooking.
May 10, 2017 at 8:04 am #7157I think alot of chest issue is simple down to out damp climate.
I like in an area of low pollution, my boy has bad asthma, buy evey year we go away to the continent, Spain and Italy are the best, and his asthma all but clears up.
Now word of a lie, evey year with in an hour of exiting the ferry his heavy breathing returns. Last week I collected ted him fro Liverpool (rip off airport). His nan said his chest has been “brilliant” (she worries), in the hour drive home, he was back k to his normal self.
Ive met uk couples in Spain southern Spain, one from Norway also, that had moved to the dryer dryer climate because of their children’s chests
May 10, 2017 at 11:37 am #7160Just to add again to Steve’s comment, one other more or less universal finding from the researchers is that cannabis is NOT a gateway drug though if it is more easily obtained then it is more widely used. (obvious really!) Richard’s response came in while I was posting but I’d decriminalise the lot and spend the money saved on rehabilitation and education. Laws are introduced for a variety of reasons – could one of these have been the close connection between MP’s Board memberships of distilleries and breweries, or the vogue at those times for all forms of Prohibition? Sometimes it is better to address the cause of a problem rather than its symptoms. I do not think cannabis has ever been a ’cause’.
Wow, you would wind things back to how they were before they caused problems. But then I guess that murder was only made illegal because the cloth makers found they could sell more product if their customers needed to buy clothes regularly rather than a one time funeral shroud. Housing standards were introduced to mop up the surplus bricks being produced and because the carpenters wanted to stick roofs on them, etc. The odd things that you can pick up.
One of the real issues with report findings is working out who paid and why, let sugar refiners submit and suddenly sugar is a god not a devil and so on.
I just hope I do not encounter any more failing addicts.May 10, 2017 at 12:14 pm #7161I think alot of chest issue is simple down to out damp climate. I like in an area of low pollution, my boy has bad asthma, buy evey year we go away to the continent, Spain and Italy are the best, and his asthma all but clears up. Now word of a lie, evey year with in an hour of exiting the ferry his heavy breathing returns. Last week I collected ted him fro Liverpool (rip off airport). His nan said his chest has been “brilliant” (she worries), in the hour drive home, he was back k to his normal self. Ive met uk couples in Spain southern Spain, one from Norway also, that had moved to the dryer dryer climate because of their children’s chests
Steve, it is true the damp can affect chests, but damp water logged houses and more especially smoke filled houses in the poorer parts of cities suffered accelerated rates of plague and poorer chances of survival or recovery.There was an interesting program on plague ‘waves’ a few years back.
When our children had a severe bout of breathing problems the doctor came round and said,
‘I should send them off to hospital for this but the set up with your humidifiers is far superior to anything the hospital has so continue to treat them here’.
Chest complaints do have a relational link to other complaints is it causal or just chance?
Visitors to sunny climates from the less sunny also suffer higher rates of skin cancer, causal or just chance.?
Dark skinned people, especially their children migrating to less sunny (and damp) locations tend to suffer accelerated rates of some vitamin deficiency, causal or random?
Less outdoor time in general appears to have an association with other kids getting vitamin issues, causal or random?
People with sickle cell problems do not usually get affected by malaria, causal or random? – Arguably there is a clear evolutionary link.
May 10, 2017 at 4:24 pm #7162Richard, I agree with the gist of what you are saying, but I don’t know that we as yet have the right terminology.
‘Evolution’ has generally become associated with the mutation of DNA. The latest research tends to point toward living organisms adjusting their RNA in response to environmental factors and the modified RNA plus its associated impacts on gene expression is then passed on to the children . (Sins of fathers etc.).
Some of these changes are probably due to our friendly (or unfriendly) gut bacteria, and perhaps having too sterile an environment. (a finger is now frequently pointed towards this as being associated with the modern asthma ‘epidemic’). A similar example of environmental exposure is that of nut allergies where more recent research shows that parents should be encouraged towards giving very young children nuts in order to avoid future nut allergy issues.
When I worked with a JV in India I knew a Hindu who was a strict follower of the Ayuvedic principles – part of which entailed him going for a daily walk in the countryside and sampling roadside ditches and ponds into a small bottle. He would then bring this evil brew back to the office, take about a quarter of a teaspoonful and dilute it with about 5 litres of clean bottled water which he would then consume throughout the day. I will admit that despite my wondering on which day he was going to catch cholera he never had a days illness during the couple of years I spent (on and off) in that part of the world. He also treated his young children in a similar manner, a practice which would probably have resulted in them all being put in care had they lived in the UK!
May 10, 2017 at 5:09 pm #7163We may be reaching somewhere nearer to common ground. Evolution does allow those with more suitable random genetic changes to survive better and reproduce than those with less favourable random genetic changes. Yes environments, especially through food intakes can change gut flora and some argue that changes can end up in the genetic make up. There is emerging evidence that the granddaughters of smokers can inherit subtle changes to their DNA which produce some issues for them as they grow up. Many do not realise that what they eat and do can have future impacts, frankly we know too little to be dogmatic.
I would not go as far as your Indian ‘friend’, but he would have been nurtured in a somewhat hostile environment so would have been better able to continue. A few years application of kill or, if not cure, at least survive may well have helped him. I agree that there is a strong body of feeling that over cleaning is the cause of many issues, not only that, some cleaning products may themselves increase lifetime complications, without achieving any real benefits. Washing with clean water gets rid of most issues – except specific contamination with water resistant substances. Adding soap get close to the magic 99.9%. Using too much soap or where it is inadvisable can cause real issues. They can be painful, enough said thank you, a one time experience was enough!
Asthma and other allergies are not to be sniffed at, sadly they can turn up and turn on at any point in one’s life and any steps that can be taken to limit or slow them down has to be a good thing. Happily I like, can tolerate and enjoy all the nuts I wish. I do not have an allergy to aspergillosis, (a sort of fungus) though my wife does, I do have some other allergies, which developed in the last few years. Possibly as my immune system either starts to give up or go rogue. They do cause breathing issues and have caused lung problems; the camera in my lungs was a novel experience. Not one normally enjoyed without a sedative, but other factors intervened that day.
May 10, 2017 at 9:44 pm #7176Richard my Sikh mate Vijay would physically shudder and squirm when talking about stuff his grandparents ate and drank. He used to have a meal at home before going there, so he could say he had eaten!
However, last time I spoke with him, his granddad was alive and well into his 90’s. Grandma was gone 20+ years ago though, probably from preparing the stuff….
As a 3rd.Gen immigrant, he seems more British than me sometimes. Loves fish & chips, roast dinners, football. First surprise I had when I first knew him, was that most Sikhs can eat all meats, including pork, although some sects are apparently vegetarian. Mainstream, most will only refuse Halal-prepared meat, when prepared according to Muslim practice. Vijay and his family opened my eyes to a great deal.
He also uses a lot of Anglo-Saxon Basic, mostly to annoy his dad. Seeing Vijay’s massive 6’4″ dad frowning, is a fearsome sight. With the Dastaar (turban) he probably tops 6’8″. Seeing and hearing him laugh, which he does a lot, is another experience.
When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.May 11, 2017 at 6:58 am #7182Bob, for many years my father who, like mother died in his nineties worked in the waste food disposal and processing industry. It was a standard joke in the industry. If the stuff now rejected from the food chain was as bad as is now claimed, the Germans would not have needed to bomb anywhere. The food would have wiped out the population before the bombers arrived.
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