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Bob Williams.
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February 5, 2018 at 4:21 pm #16593
BBC report on the Aspergers’ hacker and USA extradition:
This is interesting and concerning for me. I have spoken before about my own Gson and his Aspergers. His take on the lad who has escaped extradition, was also interesting. Gson and I talked about it at the time the lad was first arrested: his words were that it was something he probably had the knowledge and resources at home to hack into almost any server(s) anywhere, but these factors stopped him: –
*He was too busy earning a living
*His job was interesting and enjoyable in itself, without doing something so obviously dumb.
*It was a risk not worth taking, in view of the repercussions, which should have been obvious to anyone with commonsense.
He also said that the hacker was probably spoiled and had far too much time on his hands. Also, in view of the fact that he could encrypt files to the point where they cannot be encrypted, he has the knowledge and ability to gain employment.
Those are points with which I can find no argument.
When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.February 5, 2018 at 5:01 pm #16595I suspect that he is completely correct seen from his own very mature viewpoint. Sadly in the case in question that person’s viewpoint laid in a different direction, apparently without boundaries. He possibly wore blinkers as to the effects he might cause, was tied up in his own quest and therefore lost what might be termed perspective. Our daughter has her own views on everything and even when presented with clear contradictory evidence her viewpoint cannot be shifted at all. Happily to date it has been on things that do not really matter, e.g. the content of TV programmes, she will boldly state a view of a programme totally at odds with the real content. It is this unshakable belief that what some think is right is the source of danger. Happily your grandson is carving a life for himself and has a future towards which he can look. Many do not have that beaconing light and other thoughts and inward facing activities fill their waking hours. Many Asperger’s and Autism cases can have incredibly driven minds to take on even the narrowest, most minute details of subjects. Some excel at music, art, maths or computer related activities, or something else; sadly if no outlet exists for their interest trouble can find them.
I am happy for you and yours that such a sensible balanced view pervades the thinking processes.
February 5, 2018 at 5:09 pm #16598While I cannot contradict any of your gson’s observations I would ask you to consider that autism/aspergers is not a single disorder but is a spectrum of problems which crudely put runs from slightly socially inept through to potentially dangerous to society and those who love them. Equally I cannot comment knowledgeably on where Lauri Love fits on that scale, but I would guess that the Government agreed that he had a very real problem or they would have been attacking that point as well as his suicidal tendencies.
February 5, 2018 at 5:51 pm #16600Richard your views are in accordance with my own: I suspect that is due to the problems you have with your daughter.
” … even when presented with clear contradictory evidence her viewpoint cannot be shifted at all. ” – that was our gson in earlier days; I remember those days, fortunately my daughter and I were able to provide the ‘tough love’ to ride the storm. His dad went missing early, has never returned, and his grandma could not be strict enough to see that he was best helped by that same tough love.
This is full of truisms: ” Many Asperger’s and Autism cases can have incredibly driven minds to take on even the narrowest, most minute details of subjects. Some excel at music, art, maths or computer related activities, or something else; sadly if no outlet exists for their interest trouble can find them. ” I call it Tunnel Vision: when GS is faced with a task that hits his buttons, he physically and mentally cannot stop until he completes the task. I have watched him fill a large Whiteboard with Server diagrams, then translate the diagrams into Virtual Servers, to solve a customer’s problems. He takes the solution to work next day in his head and works it out for the company. His boss has learned to leave him alone until he is done. The company has trebled its customer base since GS joined them and his salary has seen increases in line with that.
Ed I am quite aware that Aspergers is just one part of the Autism spectrum, and that there are as many different forms of Aspergers as there are sufferers. I have attended National Autistic Society meetings, local and national, since the time he was first diagnosed. Which was a fortuitous happening in itself: the Deputy Head at his Primary School, was researching Autism in regard to a severely autistic child, and became interested in our GS. She helped us to make the right contacts and meet the right people, so that he was diagnosed early. That is rare, although improving. I know of a (then) 41 yo lady whose mum has always been concerned about her behaviour. I was able to spot the signs, get her to take her daughter to the right source and she was diagnosed. At 43.
I often wonder which direction our GS would have taken, had I not built his first PC. At 9 he was writing adult poetry, at 10 he painted a really beautiful painting of the lone tree across from his house, in a huge field. When he first drew it, I showed him perspective and he used it immediately. He writes no poetry and paints nothing nowadays.
When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.February 5, 2018 at 6:05 pm #16602I cannot argue with your comments Ed, except that I should add that the spectrum reaches a little wider than you suggest. At one end there are the neurotypical population and then as you travel across the spectrum more and more divers differences emerge, the far end sees those who cannot verbalise, may be violent and appear very antisocial. Some aspects can be lightly sprinkled across much of the spectrum. Violence may be the result of an almost dementia like failure to process situations, empathy may or may not exist and even then can take various forms. So instability can be another characteristic needing careful titration of mood stabilising treatments, cue big yellow van and large building memories.
It is highly complex as a huge range of difference in behaviour exist. Some seek to type people according to their behaviours allocating points to key issues to show where people may be on some mythical scale. However this is unreliable and therefore not very successful. There is evidence suggesting that some displaying autistic behaviours also have other medical and digestive issues affecting their reactions to treatment(s) and the absorption of e.g. trace elements. This is the point where some will jump in with the old cause vs effect debate.
The commonly used term is comorbidities. It can include such as thyroid issues, epilepsy or non epileptic seizures, an intolerance to some antibiotics. minocycline should probably be avoided by anyone with any sort of Asperger’s or autism – it can cause a lupus like reaction. That is really not fun. We have the worn torn tee shirts accumulated over the years.
February 5, 2018 at 6:10 pm #16604This is all very fortuitous for me, I’m awaiting an appointment with a trick cyclist for an autism/aspergers assessment.
Only came up when a relative of my mother’s’ partner that works with special needs children of all types suggested that I have some typical signs. It would make a lot of sense.
Having done the screening multiple choice questionnaires I think it’s quite likely that I can put another ailment on my list, time will tell.
February 5, 2018 at 6:23 pm #16605Richard, our GS has these, first mistakenly diagnosed as ‘Panic attacks.’ Of course he panicked, the lad didn’t know what was happening to him:
“It can include such as thyroid issues, epilepsy or non epileptic seizures…” He doesn’t exactly have a seizure, but his heart races because his thyroid is overactive.
Nolan if you are diagnosed as an Aspergers sufferer, it is not the end of the world. You will have another condition to support PIP, for one thing. Just remember, every sufferer is different, with individual symptoms and traits. See it as our GS does:
“You always told us all (grandchildren) that we were individuals granddad. Well, I am more individual than you thought!”
Btw, my SWMBO has Thyroid problems, cured held at bay by a radiotherapy treatment.
When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.February 5, 2018 at 6:52 pm #16608Bob, I’m not bothered either way, it would just explain a hell of a lot that has gone on in my past.
I honestly don’t care what others (apart from friends and family) think about me. I am what I am. Nuts to anyone that can’t deal with that. I’ve always been that way, being heavily involved in skateboarding and BMX from well over 35 years ago before they were mainstream like now suited me down to the ground.
February 5, 2018 at 7:03 pm #16609Oh, what a surprise, (Not), I found the online checker and came out in the range as well, which might explain some aspects of the children. Some questions were a bit borderline, but the ‘clear’ ones were very clear. I’m the person who would rather clear used glasses and plates wash up or (in the past – 1970s) do the music at a party than meet and greet.
I reprogrammed a 32 position training simulator, mapping out the key board by snipping out test code from an original program and thought of it as fun, then made up all the training tapes. I taught the maker a few short-cut steps for making the tapes – (it was in 1980 and tapes were OK back then).
February 6, 2018 at 9:14 am #16627Steve, this was the original thread in which I posted about an Asperger’s test. The one I found/used was on this link https://www.aspergerstestsite.com/75/autism-spectrum-quotient-aq-test/
It ‘sort of’ sounded a little more based on ‘something sound’. than some of the others, but they can all be a bit subjective and get rigged one way or the other by a different reading of the questions.
You threw me by posting back into a different thread!
February 6, 2018 at 9:31 am #16628The online tests I found came back as 74% likelihood, the questionnaires from the local Community Mental Health Team were different but essentially very similar, same horse different jockey springs to mind.
The test linked to above by richard uses some of the questions from various online tests I’ve seen so it looks like most of them are based on either one or a few core tests.
February 6, 2018 at 4:18 pm #16638Bob, I’m not bothered either way, it would just explain a hell of a lot that has gone on in my past. I honestly don’t care what others (apart from friends and family) think about me. I am what I am. Nuts to anyone that can’t deal with that. I’ve always been that way, being heavily involved in skateboarding and BMX from well over 35 years ago before they were mainstream like now suited me down to the ground.
Nolan, the boldened text is very much my Gson, although it took us a long time to realise that he really did value friends and family. In fact the last two are combined in his case: his dyslexic 19 yo male cousin is his best mate. Once together, the rest of us may as well not be there. They talk about everything under the sun, and stuff not under the sun: they share a passion for SF, probably begun by me. They fit together well, GS No.2 has bags of confidence, is outgoing and is a huge lad. He looks up to No. 1 for his intellect and Tech knowledge. (although is fine with devices himself) No. 2 will look out for No.1 and they go to an “Airsoft” game together with No. 2’s mates. This is like Paintball, but with BB guns firing soft pellets. They love it. No.2 is actually bringing No. 1 into a Social environment. It is absolute magic to see them together and makes me proud of both. No.1 is a MENSA tested genius, No. 2 is dyslexic but has a very good vocabulary and is soon to become an Electrical engineer.
When No.1 was considering Uni, I took him to Birmingham and spoke to the head of what would be his college, told him about No. 1’s Aspergers. He laughed: “Most lecturers and tutors in this department are on the spectrum!”
I took the test and am ‘Borderline’ at 34.
When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.February 6, 2018 at 5:06 pm #16642The social environment at an early age is very important. One gson was a very late talker and was rated borderline on the CARS scale. Involvement in drama classes has both improved his speech, and through the play acting bit has made him far more socially aware. Apart from being rated as very high on the logic/maths scale he is now pretty much on track for speech and social involvement and has fallen off the CARS rating.
February 7, 2018 at 5:02 pm #16674Those diagnosed in the last few years are getting more help I think, Ed. My GS attended a college which gave him a 1 to 1 form tutor who looked after him most of the day. When the college realised his aptitude with IT, they gave him and another lad one tutor for half a day, every day. This man was ex-industry, had just retired in his early fifties but wanted to ‘put something back’. He took both lads through CISCO, Microsoft and other qualifications, which meant that GS avoided Uni. He has a great job now and I do not believe that Uni would have been good for him: at that stage he was still unable to function well socially and I think he would have gone into his shell completely, surrounded by strangers. Getting into the world of work with a sympathetic company and a boss who values him, has drawn him out and he is now much improved, to the point at which he is making more and more life decisions for himself.
It has been rewarding and relieving, to see the work that his mum, my wife and I have put in over the years, bear fruit. We were very worried about his future for some time.
When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.February 7, 2018 at 5:44 pm #16676Bob, you are very correct, the world is slowly changing though other less ideal forces have not been routed. At least we got to seeing our then 19 or 20 year old signed up for a proper assessment. So proper that seven years later we are still waiting for the report!
Joking aside the kids we knew when they were little have grown up by ten years of more and their advantages from better diagnosis, support and treatment are very obvious. Our daughter is not so much stuck in the slow lane but many days appears to be stuck in reverse gear in her slow lane. She will never make the progress your GS has made, (and all strength to him, you and your’s for that). Her support worker has agreed to try again getting her to use a point to point bus. Every previous attempt has resulted in catastrophic failure with the rescue wagon needing to be sent out to fetch her back once more. There is little or no chance she will ever be able to work, so it is easy to despair about the future. We kept hoping that one more burst of assistance would tip her over into winning some small steps as from that greater gains can be made. This is just what you found with your GS. However, I guess that for every success there will also be some who will not make the gains. Maybe it is now too little too late.
February 7, 2018 at 9:01 pm #16685In view of the successes with our GS Richard, I have a great deal of sympathy for you and your wife. I can imagine the trials of your situation, having ourselves battled so long and seemingly not achieved any improvement. There were times when I held my daughter close and let her sob her heart out, and one unforgettable moment when we both wept together at a perceived lack of improvement in GS’ condition. How old is your daughter? Our GS is 24 now, but the real advance has only happened within the last two years, as he slowly began to get his working life together and learn to trust those he worked with as friends. I think it is a matter of time, plus that one factor that can happen: an activity, a success at doing something. I still see occasional lapses in our GS, as he retreats from a conversation with someone he either does not know, or has not known for long enough. But the one thing that worries me now is his Thyroid problem, which can make his heart race. He did try to take driving lessons, but his second instructor, a personal family friend, was good enough to contact me and say that he had no spatial awareness and would never be able to drive. The guy was good enough to refund the lessons money. That is actually a blessing, as GS walks to and from work now every day: 1½ miles each way. Exercise he would otherwise not have, as he is all “home and work”, which is why I have enlisted GS No. 2, to get him out at weekends.
I wish you the luck of a breakthrough with your daughter, Richard. You have enough problems with your health also.
When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.February 7, 2018 at 9:29 pm #16686Richard, I can only echo Bob’s good wishes.
Funnily enough the only thing I’ve ever been naturally good at was driving. No experience at all driving a car and at 18 decided to learn to get back to Cardiff on Sundays to skateboard and see my mates while avoiding the ridiculous delays and expense of the train system . 7 lessons (including the 2 for the test) and I passed first time, one minor for being a little close to parked vehicles.
For me independent living has always been a huge priority, I’m close enough to mum and her fella that should anything go wrong either end it’s not a big deal, but crucially they know not to come near my place without prior warning (except in an emergency).
February 8, 2018 at 7:55 am #16696Thank you Bob and PM for kind and supportive words.
The daughter in question will be 27 shortly so it feels that her life course is more or less set in stone now. She did not go to volunteer at the food bank on Tuesday as I was feeling unwell, but hopefully she will do a few hours there today. As for driving, she has no spatial awareness and can have a collision with a cup and almost anything and grade one problems with making sure that food gets into her mouth every time. Her biggest problem would be that she can panic for not just Britain but the entire world and that is not a good day. She does dream of independent living, but how she would ever get to the shops, let alone select what she wanted, pay for it and use it when she got home again I have no idea. She goes for the most complex recipes, but then cannot even get further than pealing an item or two.
For the moment it is a case of keep on trucking and hoping, (though sometimes hope feels more like road kill than a beacon).
I saw the spine man yesterday, he can do nothing for me at the moment, the great money issue, but is keeping me on the books via a six month review appointment. To be fair, spinal issues are not currently life stopping and I can walk reasonable distances, though not slowly, I lurch too much when going slowly. Once I get going quickly I am fine in a straight line and currently better than my wife who has worse ‘whole body issues’, though not with her spine.
February 8, 2018 at 8:51 am #16702As an aside to the above. The small hospital is situated on a 30 mph road that runs through a village with a church and school at its southern boundary, about 100 yards beyond the school the limit changes to the national limit for narrow roads. Anyway, after joining this road and about 600 yards along I was followed by a father and his kid as I stuck to the limit, boy did I wish I had a rearward facing camera as the git waved, jumped up and down and demanded that I speeded up, I did not. In fact I dropped down to 25 as I past the school shortly after chucking out time. Once free of the limit I speeded up to 50 ish along the winding road and the git then fell a couple of hundred yards behind. What an idiot.
February 8, 2018 at 2:39 pm #16721You can be done for a dangerous drive if doing more than 20mph going past a school at kicking out time. Even if the limit is 30 plus.
I know a number of people that have had fines and points for this back home, as the two jnr schools are on quite wide main roads. Not was about 2000ish when they started this. Peronally i approve, and hardly drive slow.
i do love to slow fools down, we have a load of county roads, so I’ll be doing 60/70 and I’ll get fools barrel down on my doing 100 plus, so I’ll slow to 40, and drift towards the middle. If the road is to wide to block, my car is quick enough to speed up before most to stop them overtaking.
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